Quote:
Originally Posted by Invert
lolz. First, one word, HYPOCRITE. Don't want to hear reasoning, you've ignored EVERY SINGLE post I've directed at you. EVERY SINGLE post.
We are trying to silence people who disagree? Um, no, I engaged with you in discussion, you ignored me. Since when has conversativism ever tried to consider conflicting views? Conservative is far more narrow the liberalism. Liberalism is after allowing laws to bring as much freedom to everyone (not just the majority or rich), as possible without infringing on the rights of other. Therefore the idea of gay marriage, without forcing churches to marry gays, but at least having the option, and court marriages maintains the anti-gay churches' rights to not marry gays, yet allows gays to get married if they want. This would be freedom.
lolz again. Our agenda? Infiltrating the church? Um, no... for example, a few weeks ago, I went to the National Union of Students LGBT Campaign conference, which is the biggest student LGBTQ movement in the UK. The conference is to decide policy on campaigns are such to focus on in the year. Guess what? The church didn't even come up. Not once. So you go find some evidence that the movement is infiltrating the church, and maybe you can make that point.
Whereas, as I pointing out, there is very little actual knowledge of the church's teachings on gay marriage in much of the early church, and middle ages. As I pointed out, as homosexuality wasnt a real concept till the lasdt few hundred years, there was little discussion on gays, and when there was, it was from specific individuals, mostly from the view that every one is straight, so gay sex is explicitly a rebellion to human nature. There is a lot of academic research on the 'clobber' passage against gays to suggest its really not all that straight forward. Go watch a documentary called 'So The Bible Tells Me So' (no, this wasnt my only source of information, they just made an easily understandable documentary, and its more interesting then all the reading I've done). |
I ignored you because you posted at a point when I was trying to get out of this thread. So get over yourself, you don't have any genius arguments that I haven't addressed already.
-Now, who is the hypocrite? Liberalism wants to bring freedom to minorities, in fact they want to give them more freedom than anyone else. They want to give freedom to illegal immigrants who have no business being here while we pick up the tab. And in them giving more freedom than necessary, more than the average American citizen, it takes rights away from regular hard working people. So by stopping ridiculous laws, or as you say "stopping freedom", they are actually working to preserve freedom for the average American. But I don't expect you to understand how that works as you probably don't work hard every day, and you probably don't pay taxes, and you've probably never been denied a scholarship/job to affirmative action.
-I've made it clear that I do not believe that most individual gays have much concern for infiltrating the church; although some obviously do, so there is no way your personal opinion speaks for the whole movement. I believe that the political leaders of the movement want to do this. Liberalism in America=socialism, and in order for socialism to succeed the church need to be over powered. Thats all I have to say about this point because I do not feel the need to repeat myself more. But it is something that a good percentage of conservatives believe; so regardless of how you feel about it there is no sense in arguing this point, because there are people who believe this, so therefor it will be an obstacle whether you like it or not.
-I've been studying catholicism for 12 years. If you want to argue about what the church teaches with me then you are barking up the wrong tree. I personally know more about what the church believes over a gay rights activist who read a few verses and talked to a self-proclaimed minister.