Triggering: Trayvon Martin-George Zimmerman

[Koharuchan]

I will definitely say I don't trust the media at all after everything they've done, however I would like to throw this out there. Last night on the news they talked about this case again; they talked about how Zimmerman had a broken nose and black eyes, the back of his shirt was wet with grass stains, etc etc, things we already know. However, they also told that Trayvon's knuckles were slightly bloody, indicating that he did throw punches. Also, they went into detail about his gunshot wound. They said that the autopsy shows that the two were probably only inches away when Zimmerman fired, and they've come to this conclusion because of the stippling left by gunpowder.

Do I trust the information? Not really. It's the media. Like I said before, I'm just throwing it out there.

[Maverick.]

Originally Posted by BigBL87

Also, I've repeatedly heard Zimmerman referred to as a "White Hispanic." The only reason he is a "white" Hispanic now is because he shot someone that was African American. If he had shot someone who was Hispanic, he would be Hispanic.d.

Get your facts straight. Zimmerman was referred to as white by the media because that's what the jerk circled on his police report that he was white.

[girlfromsocal]

really? was he blind? people are crazy these days.

[girlfromsocal]

Originally Posted by Koharuchan

What are you talking about? I've said countless times that I hate the fact that this case is getting so much attention simply because of the race issue, and that I'm sick of hearing racial stupidity concerning this case. I'm damn tired of the race card being pulled because it shouldn't matter at all.

you keep calling it it's people like you talk about usually talk about to gain something well you are just doing it in reverse and it's pretty obvious

[Symphony.]

So I first read this on a forum, but then heard it on the news later.
Remember planking?
Well the new "trend" for some is now Trayvon-ing.
What it is, is that you lie on the ground as if dead with a pack of Skittles and a can of Arizona iced tea, and have someone take a picture of it.
In my opinion, this is cruel.
Thoughts?

[NonIndigenous]

Whaaat?

I think lots of people are extremely thoughtless. They probably get drunk first and then do it I imagine. That's when all the shit goes down where I live... when people get drunk, every evening -__- ... and I have to sleep listening to shit getting broken outside.

Anyway...

[The Goblins Blade]

Sounds Retarded, but I don't see how it's cruel.

[Mitch]

Originally Posted by The Goblins Blade

Sounds Retarded, but I don't see how it's cruel.

It's cruel because it doesn't promote awareness about the case, but it mocks his death and has it represented as a joke.

[Maverick.]

I don't see it as cruel. I actually kind of support it .

[Mitch]

Originally Posted by Maverick.

I don't see it as cruel. I actually kind of support it .

Care to explain why you support it?

[NonIndigenous]

Originally Posted by Mitch

Care to explain why you support it?

I suppose it's one of those things where it "raises awareness".

I don't support it though. Mostly because it's more stupid than a bunch of cracked paving slabs.

[Mitch]

There are other ways to raise awareness but do you really think they are doing this because they care or feel sorry for him and want to help prevent this sort of thing in the future? Of course not.

[Maverick.]

George Zimmerman is back in jail.

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/201...k_in_jail.html

[dr2005]

Originally Posted by Maverick.

George Zimmerman is back in jail.

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/201...k_in_jail.html

While the circumstances surrounding it admittedly do not help his credibility at present, this is a procedural issue as much as anything. Provided his defence team can provided a suitable explanation for why the amount was not disclosed, and the judge is satisfied by that explanation, bail will be reissued (at a higher amount, in all likelihood) and he will be released again pending trial. That being said, better communication and due diligence would be a good idea going forward...

[Maverick.]

What if he is given an inane bail amount?

[dr2005]

Originally Posted by Maverick.

What if he is given an inane bail amount?

I'm not familiar with the procedural rules involved in calculating bail amounts, but if the judge is satisfied it was a genuine oversight I would not expect the bail level to be raised to a ridiculous level. It would most likely be added into the formula used or itself used as the bail amount. If the judge is not satisfied that it was an oversight, the most likely result would be that bail is refused and thus Zimmerman would spend the time before trial in jail instead. There is little to be gained by setting an absurd bail level, after all, and it could be deemed prejudicial conduct and thus jeopardise the trial itself. The more pertinent issue is how this is going to affect his credibility going forward, as his defence team have admitted they are concerned about this.

[TigerTank77]

Originally Posted by dr2005

The more pertinent issue is how this is going to affect his credibility going forward, as his defence team have admitted they are concerned about this.

I doubt it will have much effect on the trial itself. Considering the man originally surrendered himself in the first place.

The prosecution will probably hope otherwise since they've got nothing to go on.

[dr2005]

Originally Posted by TigerTank77

I doubt it will have much effect on the trial itself. Considering the man originally surrendered himself in the first place.

The prosecution will probably hope otherwise since they've got nothing to go on.

That's where the defence submission in the next bail hearing comes in. Provided they can explain this sufficiently, it won't have a bearing and his previous good record of cooperation will take precedence. If they can't, and there's something untoward going on, that will likely have a knock-on effect. It's a question of damage limitation at this stage. As for the prosecution case, we've already established that my opinion and yours are some distance apart on the strength of their case so I'm going to say agree to disagree...

[Maverick.]

Originally Posted by dr2005

I'm not familiar with the procedural rules involved in calculating bail amounts, but if the judge is satisfied it was a genuine oversight I would not expect the bail level to be raised to a ridiculous level. It would most likely be added into the formula used or itself used as the bail amount. If the judge is not satisfied that it was an oversight, the most likely result would be that bail is refused and thus Zimmerman would spend the time before trial in jail instead. There is little to be gained by setting an absurd bail level, after all, and it could be deemed prejudicial conduct and thus jeopardise the trial itself. The more pertinent issue is how this is going to affect his credibility going forward, as his defence team have admitted they are concerned about this.

I just have a feeling that they will probably give him a very high bail amount due to the fact that he and his wife were trying to do some illegal financial stuff while he was behind bars.

[TigerTank77]

Originally Posted by Maverick.

I just have a feeling that they will probably give him a very high bail amount due to the fact that he and his wife were trying to do some illegal financial stuff while he was behind bars.

Probably. Although, I love the way some of the news sites were playing it out.

"Zimmerman's Wife Arrested. Sinister plans discussed."

Oh no, they were trying not to go broke after half of their income disappeared. How dastardly.

It was hilarious.

[dr2005]

Bail now set at $1m.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-18729622

If they use the original percentage to determine how much needs to be paid, that works out at a $100,000 bond. About what I was expecting. His wife has also been released on a $1,000 bond.

[Maverick.]

His family will probably bail him out again.

What I hope happens:He gets bailed out. The media/community will shun/bash him. When his trial comes, he's guilty and served ten years minimum.

What will probably happen:He gets bailed out. The media/community will shun/bash him. When his trial comes, he will be acquitted. He will live in solitude for the rest of his life.

[Maverick.]

George Zimmerman accused of molestation.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1676729.html

[Grey Wind]

I love how these articles are written in such a way that it looks like a full grown man molesting a child, mentioning her age but not his. They are one year apart.

Look at the line edited out of the intro paragraph from the Boston and Miami Herald article on this. I don't see how anyone can't rage over the savage media spin on things like this.

Despite a last-minute rush to the courthouse by the defense to keep a witness’ damaging story out of public view, on Monday prosecutors released a recorded statement from George Zimmerman’s cousin, who said he molested her for 10 years when they were both children, beginning when she just 6 years old.

Despite a last-minute rush to the courthouse by the defense to keep a witness’s damaging story out of public view, prosecutors on Monday released a recorded statement from George Zimmerman’s cousin, who said Zimmerman molested her for 10 years, beginning when she was 6 years old.

[TigerTank77]

Originally Posted by Ibanez

I love how these articles are written in such a way that it looks like a full grown man molesting a child, mentioning her age but not his. They are one year apart.

Look at the line edited out of the intro paragraph from the Boston and Miami Herald article on this. I don't see how anyone can't rage over the savage media spin on things like this.

She also didn't actually go to the police, she told it to some news anchor she's friends with, and when questioned if there were others who could back up her statements, she responded with "Of course, but they'd just deny it, so there's no point in naming them." Also I love how this comes out rather quickly after the FBI's investigation turned up zero evidence of a racially motivated bias, despite the woman's claims that his entire family is racist.

Aka, she's full of shit, the prosecution is desperate, and despite the attempted mob rule and lynching, thankfully, it's really looking like justice will be served and Zimmerman will go free. And I REALLY hope he sues this woman for slander.

[dr2005]

Originally Posted by TigerTank77

Aka, she's full of shit, the prosecution is desperate, and despite the attempted mob rule and lynching, thankfully, it's really looking like justice will be served and Zimmerman will go free. And I REALLY hope he sues this woman for slander.

Were the witness in question "full of shit", as you put it, the defence would have succeeded in having the statement quashed from the evidence file - presumably by bringing evidence of witness unreliability. The fact that they did not, despite being fully aware of this statement, and sought to discount it on grounds of irrelevance rather than malicious falsehood would suggest there is perhaps - and I stress, perhaps - more to this claim than you are caring to permit. I can't comment further than that because I haven't heard the recording, but the judge would have struck it from the disclosure list were it as you allege. I intend to leave it to the court to decide on this and other matters relating to the trial.

[Maverick.]

Every single week there is something new in the world of George Zimmerman. Like this for example

Http://www.Robertandgladys.com

[girlfromsocal]

that had nothing todo with the case. Weird...

[TigerTank77]

Originally Posted by Maverick.

Every single week there is something new in the world of George Zimmerman. Like this for example

Http://www.Robertandgladys.com

The lawsuits that are going to come out of this case on behalf of Zimmerman are going to be hilarious to watch.

They have tried to destroy this guy and his family since day one, and they are failing miserably. It's despicable.

[joeblow9999]

Cases like this make me wish I were dictator. The race-baiting pricks in the media would be the first to get a knock on their door in the middle of the night.

[Maverick.]

I really wish they would start the trial already. Zimmerman needs to stop Judge Shopping.

[Maverick.]

George Zimmerman has a new judge after requesting one.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/31/us...zimmerman.html

[Maverick.]

As we get closer to trial, vital evidence in the prosecutions favor comes out. Trayvon's DNA wasn't on the gun. This is not looking good for Zimmerman the shooter and the defense.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1897356.html

[TigerTank77]

Originally Posted by Maverick.

As we get closer to trial, vital evidence in the prosecutions favor comes out. Trayvon's DNA wasn't on the gun. This is not looking good for Zimmerman the shooter and the defense.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1897356.html

Except that Zimmerman said specifically that he grabbed the gun before Trayvon could get it.

So if there was a struggle with the gun, it's possible Trayvon could have been grappling Zimmerman's hands instead of the gun itself. Especially if Z's got big hands, because that Smith and Wesson pictured, if it's his gun, is a very small compact made for concealed carry.

The prosecution has almost nothing to go on for 2nd degree murder. They have absolutely nothing to suggest that anything other than what Z has presented in his defense so far. I would have supported criminally negligent manslaughter, but it's obvious that the D.A. overcharged him big time.

Zimmerman is most likely going to walk, and the lynch mob is going to have to deal with it.

[dr2005]

Originally Posted by TigerTank77

The prosecution has almost nothing to go on for 2nd degree murder. They have absolutely nothing to suggest that anything other than what Z has presented in his defense so far. I would have supported criminally negligent manslaughter, but it's obvious that the D.A. overcharged him big time.

Zimmerman is most likely going to walk, and the lynch mob is going to have to deal with it.

I'm intrigued as to what exactly it is you know, outside of what has been released into the public domain, that leaves you convinced that Mr Zimmerman has an insurmountable defence which would see him acquitted of a charge of 2nd degree murder. Given that we have no actual way of ascertaining that until the defence present their case (given that application of the stand-your-ground law, and similar such defences, has to be affirmatively demonstrated by the defence), I would say the odds of it success are 50-50 at best as things stand. As such, I would be interested to hear what you feel sways the case so decisively. I don't mean that in a snide way, merely that I'm interested to see if anything new has come to light which would help the defence.

[TigerTank77]

Originally Posted by dr2005

I'm intrigued as to what exactly it is you know, outside of what has been released into the public domain, that leaves you convinced that Mr Zimmerman has an insurmountable defence which would see him acquitted of a charge of 2nd degree murder. Given that we have no actual way of ascertaining that until the defence present their case (given that application of the stand-your-ground law, and similar such defences, has to be affirmatively demonstrated by the defence), I would say the odds of it success are 50-50 at best as things stand. As such, I would be interested to hear what you feel sways the case so decisively. I don't mean that in a snide way, merely that I'm interested to see if anything new has come to light which would help the defence.

Because the prosecution has little to no evidence to overturn what Zimmerman's defense has put forth. This thing with the DNA on the gun was a MAJOR thing for them, so they think, and it does absolutely nothing to take away from Zimmerman's statements. Especially since the spent round was not ejected, meaning that there were hands on the gun when it was fired. This is the only logical explanation for why that would have happened.

They picked away at his injuries, but sworn statements from the EMTs shot that down.

The witnesses are a mess, and have been flip flopping since the beginning of the case.

The wounds on Trayvon's hands are in line with injuries one would receive from assaulting someone else.

The FBI has stated they've found no motive a racial bias or hate crime.

It's just a waiting game now. I've said it once, I'll say it again, this case was completely driven by mob rule from the start, and is now falling down around the state's ears. As it should.

[dr2005]

Originally Posted by TigerTank77

Because the prosecution has little to no evidence to overturn what Zimmerman's defense has put forth. This thing with the DNA on the gun was a MAJOR thing for them, so they think, and it does absolutely nothing to take away from Zimmerman's statements. Especially since the spent round was not ejected, meaning that there were hands on the gun when it was fired. This is the only logical explanation for why that would have happened.

To the best of my knowledge, the defence hasn't presented its case yet (nor should it at this case, seeing as we are still in pre-trial discovery), so I'm not sure what you're referring to by "what Zimmerman's defense has put forth". We have a request for a stand-your-ground-law hearing and speculation as to a self-defence argument, but as far as I can see that it is thus far. As such, I'm not sure to what extent, if any, we can assess evidence against a defence which hasn't actually been presented yet. You also seem to have overlooked my major point, which is that the defence has to affirmatively overturn the prosecution's case by way of a defence, not vice versa. As things currently stand, Zimmerman has fulfilled the actus reus and mens rea for second-degree murder. The burden is therefore on the defence to argue their case sufficiently, and until they present their evidence (particularly Zimmerman's account) and it is tested under cross-examination, I feel any other assessment is purely speculative. Hence why I have refrained from offering much opinion since the initial charge stage.

Also, do you have a source for the cartridge claim? I have not been able to find this elsewhere.

[Maverick.]

It seems the trial will be held next summer. Wish it were sooner than that.

[TigerTank77]

Originally Posted by Maverick.

It seems the trial will be held next summer. Wish it were sooner than that.

Really?! Next summer? Holy crap.

[Maverick.]

Trayvon's parents have made this website.

Http://www.changefortrayvon.com