Triggering (Abuse): Men Outnumber Women Among American Rape Victims

[TigerTank77]

http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/men...-rape-victims/

Statistics are notoriously slippery, but the figures that suggest that violence has been disappearing in the United States contain a blind spot so large that to cite them uncritically, as the major papers do, is to collude in an epic con. Uncounted in the official tallies are the hundreds of thousands of crimes that take place in the country’s prison system, a vast and growing residential network whose forsaken tenants increasingly bear the brunt of America’s propensity for anger and violence.
Crime has not fallen in the United States—it’s been shifted. Just as Wall Street connived with regulators to transfer financial risk from spendthrift banks to careless home buyers, so have federal, state, and local legislatures succeeded in rerouting criminal risk away from urban centers and concentrating it in a proliferating web of hyperhells. The statistics touting the country’s crime-reduction miracle, when juxtaposed with those documenting the quantity of rape and assault that takes place each year within the correctional system, are exposed as not merely a lie, or even a damn lie—but as the single most shameful lie in American life.

Here's some more from the http://www.nij.gov/journals/259/prison-rape.htm.

I honestly did not know this. In fact I feel bad because I didn't even consider prison rape into the whole scheme of things.

Thoughts?

[Brandon]

I think we've always known that many people in prisons get raped, but society excludes people in prisons. We don't care about them because of the crime that they've committed, and I don't think anyone is going to go out of their way to provide protection for prison inmates. So we kind of just throw the dust under the table and let prison inmates deal with their problems themselves. I'm not saying that it's right, but I can understand why it may come as a shock from people that men can get raped more than women.

[girlfromsocal]

umm I feel sorry for those who find themselves dealing with this in the correction facillity if they have not done an equal crime. Therefore, like a rapist who's in prison deals with that I don't care. But a robber . I always think of that. And think why the heck did he think it was worth it. But yea... Some of prison rape to me is just a good punishment. Others like dealers or robbers or other crimes that aren't sexual crimes or murdering someone. I consider those prison rape... So I'd think the number would be lower than that if subtracting that population who deserved it v. The ones who really didn't...

[TigerTank77]

Originally Posted by girlfromsocal

Some of prison rape to me is just a good punishment.

Please don't tell me you just said rape is okay.

Please let that have been a typo.

[dr2005]

Originally Posted by TigerTank77

Please don't tell me you just said rape is okay.

Please let that have been a typo.

Seconded. The punishment is meant to be deprivation of liberty, not bodily integrity or whatever's left of their dignity.

Anyway, I think the whole issue of prison crime is one which could do with far more exposure, if only to illustrate just how bad our chosen prison philosophy is. Dehumanising people doesn't encourage them to become better citizens or pacify them - quite the opposite - and the sooner we realise that and start doing something about it the more likely it is we'll have a prison system which corrects behaviour and reduces re-offending, rather than just being a conveyor belt as now.

[chickenonsteroids]

Originally Posted by girlfromsocal

umm I feel sorry for those who find themselves dealing with this in the correction facillity if they have not done an equal crime. Therefore, like a rapist who's in prison deals with that I don't care. But a robber . I always think of that. And think why the heck did he think it was worth it. But yea... Some of prison rape to me is just a good punishment. Others like dealers or robbers or other crimes that aren't sexual crimes or murdering someone. I consider those prison rape... So I'd think the number would be lower than that if subtracting that population who deserved it v. The ones who really didn't...

lol ok. So when does prison rape not become ok if it's a punishment?

[Snufkin]

Prisons should definitely be used to rehabilitate rather than just house people for a few years and then let them go.

But, I still think the title of this thread is a little misleading. Out in the streets, on a night out, at a party, if someone's going to get raped, statistically it's a female. Overwhelmingly so.

When it comes to prisons, abuse in general, whether it's assault or rape, is certainly out of control. But to say that men are being raped in America more than women paints a bit of a false image for me.

[Coffee.]

Originally Posted by girlfromsocal

Some of prison rape to me is just a good punishment.

Rape is never okay, regardless of the victim's history.

[TigerTank77]

Originally Posted by Snufkin

When it comes to prisons, abuse in general, whether it's assault or rape, is certainly out of control. But to say that men are being raped in America more than women paints a bit of a false image for me.

Except it's not really, because that's what happening. Some of it might be in prisons, but then again, the male to female prison population is pretty disproportionate as well.

[girlfromsocal]

it is in my opinion. Pedophiles deserve it and so do rapists. They need to feel what they did to others. This is actually mild compared to what they did. It's like an eye for an eye thing. If you rape you get raped. I don't have sympathy for that. But I already said that's not always the case. Also I don't really think murderers should live (religious beliefs) so like I don't care if whatever happens to them. It's not right for them to be raped. But I think if we had the death penalty in place and used it when someone murdered a person and weren't so lenient that wouldn't happen.

[girlfromsocal]

you may not understand this. Because you've never been raped. When it happens to you it's hard to not say pedophiles should be murdered let alone have a small taste of what they've done. Simply karma imo...

[chickenonsteroids]

Originally Posted by girlfromsocal

it is in my opinion. Pedophiles deserve it and so do rapists. They need to feel what they did to others. This is actually mild compared to what they did. It's like an eye for an eye thing. If you rape you get raped. I don't have sympathy for that. But I already said that's not always the case. Also I don't really think murderers should live (religious beliefs) so like I don't care if whatever happens to them. It's not right for them to be raped. But I think if we had the death penalty in place and used it when someone murdered a person and weren't so lenient that wouldn't happen.

You're the best type of person.

I probably hate the eye for an eye philosophy more than your post.

The death penalty is beyond unnecessary imo. It isn't a deterrent. But this isn't the thread for that.

Have you stopped to think about people who are innocent? Do you plan on just saying sorry to them if they were raped? Or would you tell someone to rape the rapist?

[girlfromsocal]

I never said anyone should make it happen.. That's terrible and no justice system should allow that. The good thing in prison whoever did it is getting punished anyway... But I'm saying I have no sympathy to pedophiles. Most victims don't... Maybe since you've never dealt with this you really can't judge how you'd feel if you were me js...


And cool but in my faith that's what's taught. And I think it would help with taxes. The death penalty would remove many in the prison system. Therefore we wouldn't have to pay for them. It's cheaper and it's fair to the murdered victim imo...

[marshpit]

Originally Posted by girlfromsocal

it is in my opinion. Pedophiles deserve it and so do rapists. They need to feel what they did to others. This is actually mild compared to what they did. It's like an eye for an eye thing. If you rape you get raped. I don't have sympathy for that. But I already said that's not always the case. Also I don't really think murderers should live (religious beliefs) so like I don't care if whatever happens to them. It's not right for them to be raped. But I think if we had the death penalty in place and used it when someone murdered a person and weren't so lenient that wouldn't happen.

"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind"

I'm not surprised men can get raped more, especially in prisons. Take a man away from women for 25 years (or even 2) and he'll get a little horny. So it would make sense that men in prison are getting raped.
Not that I'm saying it's right, because I don't think it's right at all.

[girlfromsocal]

you know I already think you're blind probably as said in my faith.. As am I. But I think the blind are better equipped when they know it and aren't unaware of it.. So what's the difference?
rape is not about sex it's about control... Rape is a form of violence and not sex. It has nothing to do with horniness. With that logic, we'd all be capable of rape which isn't true...

[Coffee.]

Originally Posted by girlfromsocal

you may not understand this. Because you've never been raped. When it happens to you it's hard to not say pedophiles should be murdered let alone have a small taste of what they've done. Simply karma imo...

I have been sexually assaulted, and it's insulting saying that all victims are as cold hearted to other victims. I believe everybody should be treated with respect, and as much anger as I may have for people who have hurt me, I would never wish anything like this upon them. I think the jails need to get their act together and protect their detainees. Yes, they're in jail, that isn't a "Rape me" card and it's a human rights violation to be doing this to our citizens.

[marshpit]

Originally Posted by girlfromsocal

you know I already think you're blind probably as said in my faith.. As am I. But I think the blind are better equipped when they know it and aren't unaware of it.. So what's the difference?
rape is not about sex it's about control... Rape is a form of violence and not sex. It has nothing to do with horniness. With that logic, we'd all be capable of rape which isn't true...

Everyone is capable of rape, everyone is capable of murder, everyone is capable of doing anything. It's our conscience and our feelings that stop us. Plenty of people in jail obviously lack that, therefore they rape.

[Snufkin]

Originally Posted by TigerTank77

Except it's not really, because that's what happening. Some of it might be in prisons, but then again, the male to female prison population is pretty disproportionate as well.

Certainly, along with males and females not being held together in prison.

There're all these "slut walks" recently trying to "take back" the fact that a woman can wear what she wants and never be in the position where she's asking to be raped. That's fair enough, and true.

What causes rape in prison between males? Are guys dressing a certain way and "asking for it"?

I just get the impression this thread is in response to all the feminism threads around here lately and it's trying to take away from the fact that, in everyday life, a woman is more likely to get raped than a man. When you remove females from the equation altgoether and throw in a bunch of criminals, the numbers start changing, and you're no longer dealing with everyday situations. There is a massive problem in prisons, but I would never assume that walking around the USA I would be more likely to get raped than a woman.

[girlfromsocal]

actually marshpit that's just you... As you know not everyone is born with a conscious and we still have no desire to do such...


and revolution I never said all... So what's your point... To me I think it's kind we don't kill pedos... You think they deserve comfort and care... We're all individuals... Many would say we should put them down... I am just saying if it happens.. I can't say they didn't have it coming. Pedophiles shouldn't be on our priority unless it's how to make sure they stay in prison or on ways to punish them more not to lighten their burden. People pay for what they do sometimes that's how life is. They aren't victims. They're still monsters . I don't give my sympathy to monsters. That's reserved to humans.


I'm not coldhearted but you know what is coldhearted raping an innocent child is indeed beyond coldhearted. They no longer have hearts. They deserve nothing good when they've committed such a horrendous act the most innocent human beings.

[TigerTank77]

Originally Posted by girlfromsocal

rape is not about sex it's about control... Rape is a form of violence and not sex. It has nothing to do with horniness.

That's not actually how it works.

There are four kinds of rapists, according to FBI typographies.

The power-assertive rapist, the power-reassurance rapist, the anger-retaliation rapist, and the anger-excitation rapist.

Each has different methods of approach, and different styles of what they do. The only one who's really out for power and to hurt women, is the Anger-Retaliation. The other types all get their sexual kicks out of control and abuse.

Rape is about control and sex. Sexual gratification through control, and in some cases, abuse and violence. To the rapists, it is a form of sex.

I would encourage everyone to take a class on sexual offenses and offenders, it's really good knowledge to have.

Originally Posted by Snufkin

[font="Palatino Linotype"][color="DarkSlateGray"][size="2"]

What causes rape in prison between males? Are guys dressing a certain way and "asking for it"?

There are no women in male prisons. So the weaker men are made into "women" and are often pimped out. Yes, it is as bad as it sounds.

And usually, the ones being abused are the ones in there for non-violent offenses, because they're seen as weaker.

Originally Posted by Snufkin

I just get the impression this thread is in response to all the feminism threads around here lately and it's trying to take away from the fact that, in everyday life, a woman is more likely to get raped than a man. When you remove females from the equation altgoether and throw in a bunch of criminals, the numbers start changing, and you're no longer dealing with everyday situations. There is a massive problem in prisons, but I would never assume that walking around the USA I would be more likely to get raped than a woman.

I'm aware, but it exposes a huge double standard. Women march in the streets because they want to wear something that makes them look like something, and are mad because people think that they look like said something. All it takes to completely uproot and pretty much destroy a man's life is a simple accusation, true or not. And in the cases of false accusations, women are almost never punished.

Meanwhile, there's an even larger issue no one cares about because society has an incredibly retarded view about the prison system. The quickest way to take away someone's humanity is to put them behind bars, and society is all too happy to turn a blind eye. 216,000 people, all abused multiple times, and no one cares.

[marshpit]

Originally Posted by girlfromsocal

actually marshpit that's just you... As you know not everyone is born with a conscious and we still have no desire to do such...

You may not have the desire but you are still fully capable of raping someone. You could be forced into it, pressured, or just think that no one would know.
And when you say we, do you mean you were born without a conscience? But you are correct, some people aren't. Which makes them more likely to commit crimes.

[girlfromsocal]

not really if they're smart... And you're really showing a side to you no one wants to know marshpit... See reason you would think my stance is wrong because you specifically have those tendencies...

yes I know tig but like I'm saying not just normal people do that. And also rapist aren't all men and they aren't all after the female sex... The way you put that excluded a lot of scenarios js...

[TigerTank77]

Originally Posted by girlfromsocal

yes I know tig but like I'm saying not just normal people do that. And also rapist aren't all men and they aren't all after the female sex... The way you put that excluded a lot of scenarios js...

Anger-Retaliation rapists almost always go after females. The other profiles vary a bit more.

[marshpit]

Originally Posted by girlfromsocal

not really if they're smart... And you're really showing a side to you no one wants to know marshpit... See reason you would think my stance is wrong because you specifically have those tendencies...

I'm showing common sense my dear, it doesn't take a genius. Now if the only argument you have is calling me a rapist I'm done with this conversation.

[girlfromsocal]

actually I know one situation that wasn't.. Either way you referred to all of it as if all rapist were men and victims were women... That's inaccurate.

[girlfromsocal]

nope it's not common sense to claim people without consciouses go to prison... Js... It isn't. Think if any person has a small bit of intelligence. They'll know why they could break the law. A reasob could be the subject of this thread and prison in general. Just a thought...

[marshpit]

Originally Posted by girlfromsocal

nope it's not common sense to claim people without consciouses go to prison... Js... It isn't. Think if any person has a small bit of intelligence. They'll know why they could break the law. A reasob could be the subject of this thread and prison in general. Just a thought...

Please feel free to point out where I said everyone without a conscience is going to prison. I said they are more likely to commit crimes. Intelligent or not, everyone has their moments when they don't use their heads.

[girlfromsocal]

I think low iq corelates to committing a crime and in those cases a conscious would help. Otherwise I don't think so so. Also it matters on temperament. You say everyone's rash but we're not. Some people are well planned out every move and every thought.. Not everyone is like that hate to break it to you...

[Guile]

Originally Posted by TigerTank77

Anger-Retaliation rapists almost always go after females. The other profiles vary a bit more.

Not to sound idiotic here.

But what about the people who rape simply because of sex, not power, not some sort of fetish, but simply because they want sex? Sure, a good deal of it is based primarily on a feeling of authority or revenge, but at the same time, there has to be some who really, just aren't getting sex.

Originally Posted by chickenonsteroids

You're the best type of person.
The death penalty is beyond unnecessary imo. It isn't a deterrent. But this isn't the thread for that.

That's because we make such a legal mess out of it and then do it behind closed doors. If you want it to really be a deterrence, public executions are the way to go!

[TigerTank77]

Originally Posted by Guile

But what about the people who rape simply because of sex, not power, not some sort of fetish, but simply because they want sex? Sure, a good deal of it is based primarily on a feeling of authority or revenge, but at the same time, there has to be some who really, just aren't getting sex.

Thats what they're doing. The power and control and abuse- THAT IS sex to them.

But if you're talking about desperation... doesn't really happen that much believe it or not. If it did, it'd probably be a Power Assurance thing, but it's incredibly rare for rape to occur at the hands of someone who just hasn't been laid in a while.

I haven't been laid in a year and a half and it hasn't hit me at all. Haha.

[dr2005]

Originally Posted by Guile

That's because we make such a legal mess out of it and then do it behind closed doors. If you want it to really be a deterrence, public executions are the way to go!

Been there, tried that. Made no difference whatsoever. People become desensitised to acts of gratuitous violence if they seem them often enough.

@girlfromsocal: The entire rationale behind criminal law is that certain acts (murder, rape, assault etc.) are in direct contrast to societal ideals and as such should be shown to be disapproved of and discouraged by way of sanction. In light of this, I would ask you to justify your argument that society should then turn a blind eye to such acts being committed simply because it happens to someone who's broken the law and is being punished for it - that to me creates a situation where society both condems and tolerates the same course of action dependent on which group the victim is in, which is discriminatory and unsustainable.

[NevermindMe]

I think the North American justice system is beyond flawed.

He house inmates for a while, allow them to be tortured in prison by other inmates and then once, in addition to pre-existing issues have pshycological trauma, we set them loose on the world.

I think it comes down to us deciding what crimes can and cannot be rehabilitated. Most small-time criminals can be "fixed", in which case we can focus on fixing it.

Serial killers, rapists and pedophiles on the other hand are usually repeat offenders and show no remorse. As a result either death penalty or life sentences are acceptable punishments. If someone has shown themself to be too crazy or dangerous to be rehabilitatted there's no reason to try.

- Justin

First of all, rape is never okay, even if you are in prison and guilty as sin of the crime you were convicted of. It's easy to dehumanize prisoners. If you ever watched "The Dark Knight," a man on the civilian boat during the Joker's twisted social experiment said that "they had their chances; why should we suffer because they screwed them up?" I think it really captures the attitude towards inmates today, as well as homeless people and a few other fringe groups. But I digress.

I'll admit though, I am surprised that male rape victims now outnumber female rape victims. I guess given the vast mess of the U.S. correctional system I shouldn't be. But no matter who you are, you never deserve to be violated like that.

Now, I will admit that that lines becomes more hazy for me when it comes to inmates convicted of sexual crimes, especially of those against children. It's easy to think, "Hey, they raped/assualted others, so they deserve the same treatment." I've felt pretty impersonal to sex crimes committed against convicted sex offenders at times.

But in the end, I know that it's still not right. I would be a hypocrite if I were honestly to claim rape is okay sometimes and not okay at others. That starts a very long, slippery slope on an issue that is very black and white. That's the kind of logic people use when they say "She deserved it; she was dressed like a whore."

You can either violate humans or you can't. I vote that you can't.

[CaterToMadness]

@girlfromsocal

>Says others don't have a conscience
>Condones rape of rapists/pedophiles

Please continue contradicting yourself.....